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« Bono on gospel music, the blues and the Lord’s Prayer
The evidence that vocal training really gives results – get ready for goosebumps »

Controlling volume overspill in church part 2 – identifying the noise-makers

By Guest Blogger | August 17, 2012

In my original post on  controlling volume overspill in church, I spoke specifically about noise problems outside of the building, concluding with the statement: If you seriously need to reduce the volume spill into the outside world then you should speak to your local acoustic consultant. However, in the light of the various comments I think it appropriate to delve into this topic further.

Perhaps I should reiterate, my last post was purely responding to a question about sound spill OUTSIDE of a building. Now I’d like to think about sound spill INSIDE. Sorry to be so blatant, but there is a big difference between these, so I’d rather be too verbose than make assumptions…

There seem to be two themes appearing from the comments on the last blog: reducing the overall volume inside the Church; and altering the fabric of the building to reduce noise / echo / flutter / reverb inside the Church.

These two elements go hand-in-hand; after all it is the direct sound (PA, instruments, spoken word, etc) that causes diffuse sound (echo, flutter, and reverb). I often think of this as the “direct to diffuse ratio”.

It’s a common misconception that reverberation in a building can be overcome by turning up the PA, but this doesn’t really make sense: diffuse sound is just the echo of the original direct sound that’s bounced off a wall or ceiling or whatever before reaching my ears. Therefore the direct and diffuse sounds are proportional, so increasing direct sound will only increase diffuse sound. So first off, if you struggle with too much diffuse sound (echo) then you can simply reduce the level of the direct sound (PA).

Reducing the volume produced from the band & PA

First we will summarise some of the main concepts on the topic and also think about the most common noise makers (I’m thinking specifically about Churches here, but the same principles apply elsewhere of course). We’ve also added in hypertext links to various relevant Musicademy articles throughout the text here.

Here’s my list of “most common noise makers”, and some potential resolutions.

Please note; this is by no means a conclusive list…!

Noise-maker # 1 – Drums

Wow! Undoubtedly the most commonly accused “noise-maker”. If you already have the perfect answer to this, then do please let me know! If not, then there are various methods floating around to reduce drum noise.

Firstly, why not ask the drummer to play quieter? To be honest, this is the most effective solution I’ve come across, although not always the most consistent. Hot rods or canes can work to help this, although if you’re asking your drummer to play so quietly they have no dynamic range left then we’ve just suppressed their ability to express themselves musically. Music should have some ebb and flow to it, perhaps the philosophers among us could argue it is not music if there is no dynamic expression?

Drum screens  are another common solution; often the go-to option. Yes, they can really help but be careful as this is not a perfect solution. You will need to mic the kit up (at least a bit) to get the definition you lose from putting up a drum screen. Also the musicians will often ask for the drums in their monitor which can end up being as loud (or louder!) than the drums in the first place.

Many drummers I know really struggle being caged in; the sound inside their box can be really hard to work with as it gets so lively in there. Equally, if it’s not introduced with sensitivity it can send the message “you are not a good enough musician to be able to control your own volume level therefore we have to control it for you”.

I sometimes ask myself, what would happen if the money from a drum screen purchase could be used instead to give your drummers a handful of lessons from a local professional in playing quieter whilst maintaining tone…?

Electric drum kits are becoming more popular; especially in the “silent stage” model which is being employed a lot at the moment. Again, you need to put the drums back in to the foldback monitors for everyone to hear. Equally, it can be really hard to get the right sound from it. Electric stage pianos are used instead of an acoustic grand / upright piano and there are very decent products available for reasonable money; electric drum kits are different though and a kit with a great sound and feel can set you back many thousands.

Noise-maker # 2 - Amps on stage

As a guitarist, I’m allowed to say this: most guitarists have their amps too loud. Yes, the sweet-spot of the valve amp is closer to eleven than one, but this is not a stadium gig, it’s Church. Guitar amps, bass amps and keyboard amps should be turned down as much as possible; maybe even gotten rid of completely.

Controversial I appreciate, but many keys players don’t need an amp on stage; you could just use the foldback monitor. The same could be said for bass guitarists too; many players only use an amp for the pre-amp tone rather than the power, especially if the in-house PA has the ability to carry the low-end, i.e. a sub. If you can go without the amp, then why not look at a pre-amp pedal to provide the tonal shaping you’re after? Of course, if the PA is only suited for vocals, then a bass amp can be a great way to add extra low-end contour to the sound.

Andy has written a whole host of brilliant posts on guitar amps (“Small amp, great sound” –  part 1, part 2, part 3, part 4 and part 5), so I’m not going to step on his toes. Smaller amps can be amazing for Church use. Another great tactic is to get the amp pointing at the head of the guitarist rather than their ankles. Even better still: bring the amp around the front so it points backwards (not at the congregation) as this prevents unwanted spill off the stage.

I’ve experimented with putting my amp in a cupboard, which works well when I’m using in-ear monitoring. Although it is slightly disconcerting having your guitar piped in through the in-ears. And having a good, experienced engineer is vital.

Some of the multi-FX units with built-in DI outputs can be useful too. Lincoln Brewster is the man here; check out his tone if you think a multi-FX unit cannot give impressive sounds!

Noise-maker # 3 - Foldback monitors

The musicians’ monitors on-stage can easily destroy a great mix. I always say that the monitors need to be 10dB quieter than the main PA. If there is not this 10dB drop then the monitors will always fill your crystal clear mix with wash and muddiness. I’ve even used a freebie phone-based app to measure this 10dB difference in the past! It doesn’t have to be accurate, as long as you’re able to measure that 10dB drop…

Again as a musician I’m preaching to myself here as much as anyone: musicians often put too much into their monitor mix. In most Churches, the band are close enough together to be able to hear each other without the need for monitoring anyway. It’s just the vocals and non-self-amplified instruments (e.g. acoustic guitar, DI’d keyboard) you’ll need to trickle into the mix to hear. Less is more is most definitely the adage here. Also, as the guitarist I don’t necessarily need to hear what the seventeenth backing vocal is doing; it’s not a harsh statement, I’m just suggesting that in order to help reduce the volume, I should reduce the number of things in my mix.

In-ear monitoring or IEM can be interesting, although you MUST have a mix per musician; you cannot share IEM mixes as they are so finely tuned to the individual musician. You can spend big money on IEM solutions, especially the wireless versions, although shoe-string versions are out there too. I can guarantee that you will add a lot of time to your sound check if you run IEM. It’s easy enough to make-do with a roughly mixed wedge or spot monitor, but if your IEM feed is slightly out it can be almost impossible.

Noise-maker # 4 - Main PA

An obvious one! If you’re driving your PA too hard then perhaps ask yourself why? Maybe the people at the back can’t hear otherwise; or you’re trying to fill a black spot; perhaps there is not enough bass in your system? If you answered “yes” to any of these questions then I would suggest speaking to someone in the know. Driving your PA too hard to counteract these problems is just proof that the problem lies with the speaker system itself.

Maybe you just like it loud? Of course if this is louder than everyone else wants it, then that’s not so helpful… It might even be worth coming up with some volume / SPL readings for your Church service and then mix to an SPL meter? I started doing this a while ago and it’s actually a really hard discipline, but if it means I’m serving the Church more effectively because of it, then why not?

Ok, so perhaps there is more there than I was expecting to write this time around…! This is just the tip of the iceberg too. Reducing the stage and PA volume can be a really hard juggling act. The astute reader will notice that I’ve not got technical and geeky at all here; these are all practical solutions you can employ before getting behind the desk.

In part 3 of this series we will consider how to alter the fabric of the building to reduce echo and reverb.

Tim Horton is Project Manager at SFL Group.

 

 

 

 

 

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This entry was posted in Ask the expert, Tech stuff and tagged Church stuff, pa, sound proofing. Bookmark the permalink. Trackbacks are closed, but you can post a comment.
  • James

    Good stuff. For most small churches, this issue is a constant fight.
    For our church, it has been a slow improvement over time. First caging/micing the drums then going all IEM then taking all amps off stage and using DI boxes. We actually feel like we have control of the sound now.
    But what’s the goal?
    I just had this discussion with my pastor this past week. Our job as “the sound guy” is to create an environment of praise and worship. A place where people can worship with as little distraction as possible. If the symbols and snare are tearing into the mix and making ears bleed, it really hinders the environment. I’ve heard of some guys who will carry around a db meter and turn everything up until they just hit the limit of how loud it “should” be. While every week someone complains it’s too loud, their response is “I was never above the limit. See?” and show them the db meter. That maybe true but obviously it was too loud for that guy.
    Or there’s the other end of the spectrum where you can hear the acoustic guitar directly instead of through the PA (too quiet). Or when you can hear the lady 8 rows back singing out of tune better than the lead vocalist. People can sometime become very self conscious when everyone around them can hear them sing and end up just standing there the entire service.
    I’ve been training my guys to watch the crowd during worship and use them as your gauge for how loud it is. Do they look distracted or reserved in their body language? Are they “into it”? I know we can’t please everyone but generally, they will tell you if your mix is “there” or not. It can be hard for some guys to dig their head out of the technology/numbers and into the what God is doing in a service and move with Him.
    The mixer is an instrument. Are we worshiping with it?

  • http://www.facebook.com/chris.strickland Chris Strickland

    You raise a few good points, but they can be generalized to lack of good practice. The problem you point out with direct to diffuse ratios is a result of not knowing how to handle the problem. Many incorrectly assume that the answer is to increase the house volume, but as you point out that merely exacerbates the problem.

    The drummer is the most commonly accused and ill-treated of the church musicians, followed closely by the bass player, but they are, as a unit, the most important section. I think the problems come from a lack of knowledge about the respective jobs of the band members.

    The most important thing the drummer can do (in modern style) is keep the backbeat prominent, and by that I mean emphasizing two and four, primarily on the snare. Many church drummers lack the experience to realize the importance of the backbeat in keeping the band together and promoting the groove, and they emphasize toms and splash over the less ‘sexy’ fundamentals. The bass players, likewise, tend to play runs when they should be locking onto the kick and establishing a groove.

    Many churches turn down the bass player and wrap the drummer in shields to try to overcome the busy-ness of the rhythm section, but in doing so they only isolate the rhythm (and the groove) from the rest of the band. Instead, they should promote openness and unity in the band by emphasizing the responsibilities of the different players – first by establishing the roles of the rhythm section, and then by recognizing the roles of the rest of the band in relation to the song.

    In theory, the drummer and bass player should be able to carry the song by themselves, and the other players should provide accentuation and harmonic context to the whole. This ideal is rarely evident in live settings, but it is completely obvious (to the seasoned listener) in recordings.

    Amp and monitors often bleed through the mix, as you point out, but that again is a result of inexperience or lack of knowledge of best practice. While most players start with 100 or so amps while they play in the garage, those who play long enough in venues with house equipment soon realize that their 5 or 10 or 15 watt amps are the best choices. They can redline those for good sound, and the proper mic placement or direct outs can capture that sound for reproduction, which is the job of the PA.

    The PA itself is often incorrectly handled, as you point out, getting louder and “mushier” as result. Few church soundmen have experience outside of the church, having been conscripted into the service as either available or responsible. Very few have any grounding in the science of sound, and very few are knowledgeable about how to use the EQ to enhance the band. Most simply turn up individual channels in the mix, without trying to understand the underlying problems.

    Best practice indicates, almost always, that turning down a trouble spot is the solution to a sound problem, but very few of those behind the board are aware of basic frequency ranges and solutions to common sound problems. In general, what they do is respond to complaints about sound by practically removing them from the mix.

    It seems to me that church musicians feel that the anointing will cover any lack of technical expertise, but I think that we should hold ourselves to a higher standard in God’s service. We should be sensitive to God’s presence in the service, but we should inform that sensitivity with knowledge.

  • Adrian

    we have a Victorian Methodist chapel and the stage (which used to be the sanctuary) has a half round ceiling.In effect a big mixing chamber.
    We had two drummers who were really loud so we built an enclosed box which was a drum screen with 2 panels left,one at 45 degrees,two across the front,another 45 degrees and two the other side.
    the bottom was made of 3/4″ ply and the back and top was 2″x1″ timber with1/4″ ply top and bottom with rock wool in between.We got it made in time for a new drummer who plays a lot softer anyway.It worked well and killed the kit stone dead.Next problem is that i have a Hammond C3 organ and the valve Leslie tends to `suck in all the other instruments and lend sound to the choir mics hanging not five feet away.First off we put the Leslie into a back room and mic`d it up.
    Its useable like that hearing it back through the monitors but sounds a little odd.
    The drummer has been using a 16 channel desk and having a headphone send to a pair of headphones in the booth.But this still relies on the sound men who have enough trouble doing the main mix as well as bothering with the monitors.Our solution to start with is to get a Behringer powerplay network monitor system.The drummers 16 ch desk is replaced with a send unit.A network cable sends it to the stage where the drummer has a 16 channel receive mixer unit.He can mix those 16 channels ,add pan,bass,mid and treble and volume to his taste without bothering the sound guy.being on the keyboards,i will have one too and wear headphones so i too can do my own mix irrespective of what the drummer has set!ideally i would like all the monitors to have their own mixer which could then be fed into the monitor amps so all monitors are seperated from the desk.At £900 for the whole system for 5 receive units,its a lot cheaper than the market leader in this field ,Aviom.
    We too have problems in the musicians not having `real world` experience.The up and coming youngsters seem to want to have a dabble in every instrument but not make a proper go of anything.
    Also the guitarists-used to leading worship just on their own ,don`t listen to the drummer and tend to try and set the rhythm themselves.Again yes the Bass players don`t set a Groove,but fiddle around like frustrated guitarists.the capo seems to be prevalent among church guitarists,whereas no-one used one in the secular bands i was in.
    all for now

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